oil mixing question
10-05-2010, 01:13 PM
#46
This may be a little off topic, because it's really not a synthetic vs convention oil thread, but I've seen several Toyotas (I used to work at a Toyota dealership) that have gone in excess of 300K miles on the "cheap" conventional oil supplied in bulk form at the dealership. Most of these engines don't leak oil or consume oil either.... So when someone achieves high miles with synthetic oil, I always shrug my shoulders and think to myself, hey--no big deal. I've seen the same thing with oil that costs less than 99 cents/quart.
Toyotas are amazing vehicles. Many of the older high mileage cars needed nothing but standard maintenance, despite having hundreds of thousands of miles on them. The bodies always look rusted out though....
I own a 4Runner that will probably run forever as long as I change the oil regularly.
Toyotas are amazing vehicles. Many of the older high mileage cars needed nothing but standard maintenance, despite having hundreds of thousands of miles on them. The bodies always look rusted out though....
I own a 4Runner that will probably run forever as long as I change the oil regularly.
10-05-2010, 02:45 PM
#47
philter25, thanks for the long-winded responses, but the fact of the matter is that I'm not trying to prove you wrong. You're arguing with the wrong person. Actually, you're not arguing with any specific person at all...you're arguing with Nissan.
And BTW, you can keep posting excerpts from your owner's manual all day long, but that still doesn't change the fact that Nissan published conflicting information in their TSBs. I thought you understood that the verbiage in the owner's manual is more legal-speak than anything else. Of course they aren't going to say that you have to use their own special blend of ester oil in the owner's manual!
At the end of the day, I'll still follow Nissan't recommendation to use their ester oil in my car, regardless of what you say. Of course you're free to use whatever oil you choose as well.
And BTW, you can keep posting excerpts from your owner's manual all day long, but that still doesn't change the fact that Nissan published conflicting information in their TSBs. I thought you understood that the verbiage in the owner's manual is more legal-speak than anything else. Of course they aren't going to say that you have to use their own special blend of ester oil in the owner's manual!
At the end of the day, I'll still follow Nissan't recommendation to use their ester oil in my car, regardless of what you say. Of course you're free to use whatever oil you choose as well.
However, you told people that they should be using the Ester oil and not synthetic oil, which is incorrect. I didnt want a 3rd party reading this thread to think that they were required to use the ester oil and that it was incorrect to use a good synthetic in this car. There are many perfectly acceptable oil options to use in this car, not just the ester oil.
I wasnt arguing for what you were doing with your car, I was arguing over what you told other people they should be using in their car.
10-05-2010, 03:28 PM
#48
Thats perfectly fine and Im not against anything you are doing with your car. What you are doing at your intervals I think its perfectly acceptable.
However, you told people that they should be using the Ester oil and not synthetic oil, which is incorrect. I didnt want a 3rd party reading this thread to think that they were required to use the ester oil and that it was incorrect to use a good synthetic in this car. There are many perfectly acceptable oil options to use in this car, not just the ester oil.
I wasnt arguing for what you were doing with your car, I was arguing over what you told other people they should be using in their car.
However, you told people that they should be using the Ester oil and not synthetic oil, which is incorrect. I didnt want a 3rd party reading this thread to think that they were required to use the ester oil and that it was incorrect to use a good synthetic in this car. There are many perfectly acceptable oil options to use in this car, not just the ester oil.
I wasnt arguing for what you were doing with your car, I was arguing over what you told other people they should be using in their car.
I've said it before and I'll say it again-- my advice follows Nissan's own recommendation. They should be using ester oil in their car. Unless of course they follow their owner's manual to the letter of the law. But in that case I'll show them a TSB that says otherwise, which of course will put them into conflict with themselves.
10-05-2010, 04:05 PM
#49
I've said it before and I'll say it again-- my advice follows Nissan's own recommendation. They should be using ester oil in their car. Unless of course they follow their owner's manual to the letter of the law. But in that case I'll show them a TSB that says otherwise, which of course will put them into conflict with themselves.
You say you'll follow Nissan's recommendation and use Ester oil. But I can show you numerous UOA's showing their schedule 2 recommendation for Ester oil shears down to a 20 weight at 4k miles and wont hold up to 7500 miles, which of course will put anyone into a conflict with themselves. However, you'd still listen to Nissan and dont believe me and scientific proof. (Although its a moot point because you admitted that you would never go 7500 miles with the ester oil in your car, which I think is a fantastic idea....... although you would advise other people to do so. Me personally, I would never advise someone to do something that I would never do with my own car.)
Yet on the other hand, someone else will listen to Nissan's own recommendation and follow exactly what their owners manual states. But in that case you will show them a TSB that says otherwise, which of course will put them into conflict with themselves. Therefore, you dont listen to Nissan's owners manual and are going to use a TSB as proof.
So you are selectively choosing to listen to Nissan and ignore proof otherwise on one item, but not another?
How can your advice follow Nissan's own recommendation, but yet counter exactly what Nissan states in the owners manual?I wasnt on the debate team, so Im not an expert, but that makes absolutely no sense whatsoever...... unless Nissan has a mental disorder or is a politician and flip flops positions on a daily basis.
(And again, I completely 100% support and agree with your decision to use ester oil with your OCI's.... just so we dont get off track again.)
My position, just for reference so we dont get on track again, is if you follow what Nissan has recommended in writing in the owners manual and have an issue with your car and you can document that you complied with exactly what was written in the owners manual, you would be 100% covered under warranty. According to Nissans owners manual, any oil which meets API or ISLAC spec and SAE viscosity would be perfectly acceptable for use in this car and if there was an issue with the engine, you would be 100% covered under warranty. Therefore, using a synthetic oil which meets the specifications in the owners manual is 100% perfectly acceptable.
10-05-2010, 04:13 PM
#50
So to recap:
You say you'll follow Nissan's recommendation and use Ester oil. But I can show you numerous UOA's showing their schedule 2 recommendation for Ester oil shears down to a 20 weight at 4k miles and wont hold up to 7500 miles, which of course will put anyone into a conflict with themselves. However, you'd still listen to Nissan and dont believe me and scientific proof. (Although its a moot point because you admitted that you would never go 7500 miles with the ester oil in your car, which I think is a fantastic idea....... although you would advise other people to do so. Me personally, I would never advise someone to do something that I would never do with my own car.)
You say you'll follow Nissan's recommendation and use Ester oil. But I can show you numerous UOA's showing their schedule 2 recommendation for Ester oil shears down to a 20 weight at 4k miles and wont hold up to 7500 miles, which of course will put anyone into a conflict with themselves. However, you'd still listen to Nissan and dont believe me and scientific proof. (Although its a moot point because you admitted that you would never go 7500 miles with the ester oil in your car, which I think is a fantastic idea....... although you would advise other people to do so. Me personally, I would never advise someone to do something that I would never do with my own car.)
If I were an average driver (12,000 miles/year), I'd still stick with ester oil and follow the recommended change intervals.
10-05-2010, 09:00 PM
#51
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Nissan recommends that people buy their special $12/qt house brand oil. And your advice is to follow Nissan's recommendation. Despite a mound of evidence that the house brand oil is inferior to other oils in actual use.
You must work for Nissan. Or have little common sense.
In any case, your advice re: Nissan Ester oil is terrible, and people should not follow it.
10-05-2010, 09:50 PM
#52
10-06-2010, 08:45 AM
#53
You read it. Dont act like you didnt. When I disagree with someone, even if I disagree with the first line, I still read the entire thing.
Convenient that you would skip over the part that points out that you are telling people that they shouldnt be following their owners manual when your justification for your advice is following Nissan's recommendations.
And Im not wrong. You said it yourself again, you would never go more than 3500 miles on an oil change based on your normal driving. The oil you use and your OCI works. So dont advise other people to use ester oil for schedule 2 if you have no experience doing it yourself and know if it can hold up.
You shouldnt give advice unless you have first hand experience doing it to know if the advice is good or not. Your justification for that advice is that "its what Nissan recommends". However, you are giving people advice on what oil they SHOULD be using in their car based on what Nissan recommends, but then on the other hand you are telling people NOT to follow the owners manual.
I think this debate has gone past its usefulness. Theres enough information in this thread and the Blackstone Labs UOA thread for anyone reading it to make an educated decision.
I agree to disagree. We are just spinning tires at this point.
Convenient that you would skip over the part that points out that you are telling people that they shouldnt be following their owners manual when your justification for your advice is following Nissan's recommendations.
And Im not wrong. You said it yourself again, you would never go more than 3500 miles on an oil change based on your normal driving. The oil you use and your OCI works. So dont advise other people to use ester oil for schedule 2 if you have no experience doing it yourself and know if it can hold up.
You shouldnt give advice unless you have first hand experience doing it to know if the advice is good or not. Your justification for that advice is that "its what Nissan recommends". However, you are giving people advice on what oil they SHOULD be using in their car based on what Nissan recommends, but then on the other hand you are telling people NOT to follow the owners manual.
I think this debate has gone past its usefulness. Theres enough information in this thread and the Blackstone Labs UOA thread for anyone reading it to make an educated decision.
I agree to disagree. We are just spinning tires at this point.
Last edited by philter25; 10-06-2010 at 08:53 AM.
10-06-2010, 02:44 PM
#54
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I went with the GC Castrol Syntec 0w30 since it meets 502 specs for Audi and has excellent UOA posted everywhere. Like the VVEL engine, Audis are pretty hard on oil and the GC 0w30 wears better (shears less) than many of the high end 5w30 synthetics
10-08-2010, 11:48 AM
#55
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I missed it, what is GC?
I also intend to take my car in (2010 37x) with 1,632 miles on it. I have
(I think I have the ticking noise) since about 19 miles on it. I thought it was normal for this engine, I noticed it filling an RX at a local drug store and the sound was bouncing off the brick wall at the drive through.
-Coincidence?
-Does it have Ester in it from the factory?
-Is this the same noise everone talks about in terms of oil?
-Does oil actually have anything to do with the noise history on this engine...or was it just timming and assumed when a tech changed the oil the noise went away and now it is the "law" in trems of oil in this engine?
I changed the oil with the Nissan 5w30 ester and Nissan oil filter yesreday, still have the noise.
I have no idea just out loud questions I guess..
But what the... is GC? Redline and 300V I know of.
I also intend to take my car in (2010 37x) with 1,632 miles on it. I have
(I think I have the ticking noise) since about 19 miles on it. I thought it was normal for this engine, I noticed it filling an RX at a local drug store and the sound was bouncing off the brick wall at the drive through.
-Coincidence?
-Does it have Ester in it from the factory?
-Is this the same noise everone talks about in terms of oil?
-Does oil actually have anything to do with the noise history on this engine...or was it just timming and assumed when a tech changed the oil the noise went away and now it is the "law" in trems of oil in this engine?
I changed the oil with the Nissan 5w30 ester and Nissan oil filter yesreday, still have the noise.
I have no idea just out loud questions I guess..
But what the... is GC? Redline and 300V I know of.
10-08-2010, 11:56 AM
#56
Actually, I didn't. You can think I did if it makes you feel better, but I think we'll have to leave it at that.
In fact, I stopped reading your last post right where I quoted you above, just because I don't really care what you say at this point....and just to illustrate my point that I can stop reading a post whenever I feel like it. Hey, I can even stop pissing mid-stream if I want to....I guess I'm just talented like that. So go right ahead and tell me what I read or didn't read and I'll just sit back laughing all the while.
Edit: I just made it real easy to not read your posts....I just put you on my ignore list. Congrats! You're the only one on my list!
Last edited by MSCA; 10-08-2010 at 01:07 PM.
10-08-2010, 02:08 PM
#57
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MSCA
You hate TPMS. You have helped friends disable their TPMS. You want to disable your TPMS on your G.
Yet Infiniti believes TPMS is a good idea. It installs it for a reason. The owners manual says be careful when replacing tires to ensure TPMS continues to work properly. The owners manual says be careful with some electrical devices and transmitters because they may temporarily interfere with proper TPMS operation. Infiniti even built a TPMS malfunction detector which warns the owner that TPMS is on the fritz so the owner can fix his TPMS. Clearly, Infiniti wants the tires on its vehicles to be monitored by TPMS.
You flat reject Infiniti's recommendation with respect to TPMS. But you blindly follow their recommendation with regard to that overpriced snake oil they want to sell you, without even considering the mound of evidence showing it performs horribly.
So here's the deal: you don't get to tell others "Follow Infiniti's recommendation", because you don't do it yourself. You need to come up with a whole different reason to advocate Nissan Ester oil, preferably one based on evidence. Good luck with that.
You hate TPMS. You have helped friends disable their TPMS. You want to disable your TPMS on your G.
Yet Infiniti believes TPMS is a good idea. It installs it for a reason. The owners manual says be careful when replacing tires to ensure TPMS continues to work properly. The owners manual says be careful with some electrical devices and transmitters because they may temporarily interfere with proper TPMS operation. Infiniti even built a TPMS malfunction detector which warns the owner that TPMS is on the fritz so the owner can fix his TPMS. Clearly, Infiniti wants the tires on its vehicles to be monitored by TPMS.
You flat reject Infiniti's recommendation with respect to TPMS. But you blindly follow their recommendation with regard to that overpriced snake oil they want to sell you, without even considering the mound of evidence showing it performs horribly.
So here's the deal: you don't get to tell others "Follow Infiniti's recommendation", because you don't do it yourself. You need to come up with a whole different reason to advocate Nissan Ester oil, preferably one based on evidence. Good luck with that.
10-08-2010, 02:24 PM
#58
Incorrect. I never said I hate it. Not even close.
You have helped friends disable their TPMS.
Yes, that's because THEY didn't want TPMS and I know how to bypass it. And FWIW, never on any Nissan/Infiniti vehicle, only on Toyotas.
You want to disable your TPMS on your G.
I have no desire to disable the TPMS on my G37 until it is rendered inoperable due to the batteries failing in the sensors, which will take approximately 7 years based upon the life expectancy of the batteries in the sensors. And at that point, it will already be disabled. I'll only bypass the dashboard warning light with my modification to the TPMS
Yet Infiniti believes TPMS is a good idea.
Really? How do you know that Infiniti believes it's a good idea? Did you talk to someone who makes those kinds of decisions?
It installs it for a reason.
Yeah, it's call a law. They have no choice in the matter.
The owners manual says be careful when replacing tires to ensure TPMS continues to work properly. The owners manual says be careful with some electrical devices and transmitters because they may temporarily interfere with proper TPMS operation. Infiniti even built a TPMS malfunction detector which warns the owner that TPMS is on the fritz so the owner can fix his TPMS. Clearly, Infiniti wants the tires on its vehicles to be monitored by TPMS.
Clearly they have no choice but to equip their vehicles with TPMS.
You flat reject Infiniti's recommendation with respect to TPMS.
Wrong. Completely wrong. Like I said, my TPMS is still operational. I have no desire to disable it until it is already non-functioning due to the batteries dying.
But you blindly follow their recommendation with regard to that overpriced snake oil they want to sell you, without even considering the mound of evidence showing it performs horribly.
Snake oil? No, it's ester oil. And it comes recommended by Nissan. And it doesn't perform horribly. And I change it in less than 4,000 miles anyway.
So here's the deal: you don't get to tell others "Follow Infiniti's recommendation", because you don't do it yourself.
No, here's the deal: Your entire post is full of FAIL from your very first sentence. Nice try on the correlation, but it is completely flawed and not at all relevant. I actually do follow Infiniti's recommendation.
You have helped friends disable their TPMS.
You want to disable your TPMS on your G.
Yet Infiniti believes TPMS is a good idea.
It installs it for a reason.
The owners manual says be careful when replacing tires to ensure TPMS continues to work properly. The owners manual says be careful with some electrical devices and transmitters because they may temporarily interfere with proper TPMS operation. Infiniti even built a TPMS malfunction detector which warns the owner that TPMS is on the fritz so the owner can fix his TPMS. Clearly, Infiniti wants the tires on its vehicles to be monitored by TPMS.
You flat reject Infiniti's recommendation with respect to TPMS.
But you blindly follow their recommendation with regard to that overpriced snake oil they want to sell you, without even considering the mound of evidence showing it performs horribly.
So here's the deal: you don't get to tell others "Follow Infiniti's recommendation", because you don't do it yourself.
10-08-2010, 03:35 PM
#59
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I am asking as nice as I know how (not taking any sides based on the limited knowledge I have on oil) but can we go back to just posting facts or independet documents or testing to provide information to help the forum members make their own choice on oil. I would like to have the info as I am sure would others... and to be blunt some people on here have a ton of knowledge we all can share and better the forum. Some know oil, some know thermodynamics, audio, wax etc. Example -my car is silver and I know silver adds like 1.897 hp over black (based on summer heat and under hood temps... I read that on a forum once 
, just a joke. Thanks.
Now wtf oil am I supposed to use
?
Lets also talk about oil gaskets and varnish. It's not just about metal to metal or noise. Anyone know how this ester oil "conditions" gaskets v. other brands or swells them over time? Ability to not form a varnish? At what temp does it burn off v. others? Anti-foam? Let's not forget taste - kidding, don't taste.
Now tell me what oil to use damn it or I am going to keep posting crap, whine and smiley faces. I'll do it
.
, just a joke. Thanks. Now wtf oil am I supposed to use
? Lets also talk about oil gaskets and varnish. It's not just about metal to metal or noise. Anyone know how this ester oil "conditions" gaskets v. other brands or swells them over time? Ability to not form a varnish? At what temp does it burn off v. others? Anti-foam? Let's not forget taste - kidding, don't taste.
Now tell me what oil to use damn it or I am going to keep posting crap, whine and smiley faces. I'll do it
.
10-08-2010, 04:23 PM
#60
Well, you have a couple of basic choices:
You can just have faith in Nissan's engineers and use the ester oil that they recommend, or you can listen to a couple of guys waving oil analysis papers in theirs hands who think they know better than Nissan's engineers. Oh, and don't worry, they'll try to dazzle you with their so-called facts and proof and evidence etc... but at the end of the day, Nissan engineers still recommend that you use their own ester oil. But of course the choice is yours. My choice? Well, I'll go with ester oil, obviously
You can just have faith in Nissan's engineers and use the ester oil that they recommend, or you can listen to a couple of guys waving oil analysis papers in theirs hands who think they know better than Nissan's engineers. Oh, and don't worry, they'll try to dazzle you with their so-called facts and proof and evidence etc... but at the end of the day, Nissan engineers still recommend that you use their own ester oil. But of course the choice is yours. My choice? Well, I'll go with ester oil, obviously