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Working in the auto industry, comments like this make me laugh. I get it because most everyone has had a bad dealership experience so the thought is if one person is bad in this industry then they all must be. The reality is people do exactly what you are doing and suggesting all the time.
The thing is, I've owned over 40 cars in my driving lifetime, about a third of them bought at a dealer (from NJ down to Orlando) and every single one bought at a dealer, with the exception of my wife's then-new CX5 bought at the Mazda dealer, the dealership has screwed us somehow. Even my G which was bought at a dealer in Orlando, they increased the price $2k while I was enroute, originally told me it also came with the OEM wheels (when I got there and asked, they had to send a tech to get them from his house), and it had a frozen caliper they said was 'normal'.
With the Mazda dealer, the local one wanted $7k more on a $25k car and then tried to tell us at oil change intervals that not using Mazda-branded light bulbs voided the entire vehicle's warranty. I will note, that Mazda the car company does not make or brand light bulbs, and the Ahura Mazda bulb company went out of business in the 1960s.
Then the Nissan dealer 'forgetting' they had to remove the brake master in my G until they had the car apart, and wanting an extra $800 to finish the job. Even though that step is in the FSM and was quoted as part of the initial labor.
So yes - my empirical experience with dealerships is that they are out to screw with us in any way possible.
I also knew some car salespeople pretty well when I lived in NC. Knew them from the rehab program I volunteered with through college.
My local dealer tested the battery I bought from them that was still under warratny. They had to remove the battery to place it in the tester, and if it passed the test, they’d reinstall it and wouldnt charge a penny. But if it did not pass and they had to replace it under warranty, they would charge me $100 for the labor to remove the failed battery and install the new one. Exact same amount of labor in each scenario. How transparently scammy can they get?
Last edited by STownSaint; 10-06-2023 at 08:36 PM.
I can't say I've ever had THAT bad of a dealership experience. I go into any transaction knowing the other side and me are both trying to come out ahead. Play games, and I thank them for their time, get up and walk. Almost always get a call back though.
Service departments are where they really try and screw you, which is probably why I do my own maintenance and trade in cars before expensive out of warranty problems pop up
My local dealer tested the battery I bought from them that was still under warratny. They had to remove the battery to place it in the tester, and if it passed the test, they’d reinstall it and wouldnt charge a penny. But if it did not pass and they had to replace it under warranty, they would charge me $100 for the labor to remove the failed battery and install the new one. Exact same amount of labor in each scenario. How transparently scammy can they get?
So you would be happier if they charged you $100 to test your battery and it came back ok? They were probably just cutting you a break for the option not to charge you because most shops would charge you labor either way. They have to pay their technicians for doing work. Labor rates are crazy high just about everywhere now because cars are so full of new electronics which means dealerships have millions of dollars worth of specialty tools and equipment that corner shops that just do simple maintenance do not.
I'm sure we all have dealership stories. Sometimes I forget how lucky I am to be a gearhead working for a dealer group that does not take part in shady business practices.
The WRX TR now sounds like it will be the top trim level with a manual transmission- a complete reversal of the value packed original TR trim. Estimates range from $44-$48k!?! This seems ridiculous for a WRX with no more power and it makes the Civic Type R seem like a bargain. At least it looks like it will not have the massive rear wing and it should have stickier tires. It sounds like it might ride a bit more harshly with stiffer springs, but maybe the retuned dampers will help with that.
So you would be happier if they charged you $100 to test your battery and it came back ok? They were probably just cutting you a break for the option not to charge you because most shops would charge you labor either way. They have to pay their technicians for doing work. Labor rates are crazy high just about everywhere now because cars are so full of new electronics which means dealerships have millions of dollars worth of specialty tools and equipment that corner shops that just do simple maintenance do not.
So you don't see a problem with them charging for something that's covered under warranty?
So you don't see a problem with them charging for something that's covered under warranty?
DOH! Totally missed that part. Nevermind... That does sound strange, but it sounds like the warranty terms of the battery, not the dealership. In other words, the battery warranty covers the cost of the battery, but not labor and the dealership may have cut him a break on labor feeling bad about charging him labor for not fixing anything if the battery was ok.
I'm sure we all have dealership stories. Sometimes I forget how lucky I am to be a gearhead working for a dealer group that does not take part in shady business practices.
Folks that work at the dealerships are just folks like us that put their pants on in the morning and just want to feel fulfilled by the work they are doing.
The real issue behind any of these predatory practices is directly linked to how they are incentivized and compensated. Once you have an understanding of that, it’s pretty easy to build relationships with service folks and sales people at the dealer.
Folks that work at the dealerships are just folks like us that put their pants on in the morning and just want to feel fulfilled by the work they are doing.
The real issue behind any of these predatory practices is directly linked to how they are incentivized and compensated. Once you have an understanding of that, it’s pretty easy to build relationships with service folks and sales people at the dealer.
That's a good point. Our stores are not paid on commission so I am sure that helps a bit. I think it also stems from the top down. If you have sleazy owners you more than likely end up with some sleazy employees.
Seems that the industry was getting better into 2019 and manufactures were trying to adhere to competitive pricing centered around invoice price and lower profit margins. Honest sales strategies created by companies like Saturn were now commonplace. Meaningless add-ons like the "pin stripe package" and "Lifetime Paint Warranties" were a thing of the past. The cost of money was cheap and residual values were reasonable, so leases were an attractive option. Then COVID hit, supply chain shortages followed because automotive manufactures shut down their CM capacity in early 2021, then ramped heavy at the very end of 2021/early 2022 when they realized the world wasn't coming to an end. This move snatched up the capacity from other companies because automotive is deemed critical/head of the line, and the global infrastructure built in the 1950s suddenly hit a breaking point; simply finding shipping containers became an art form and shipping prices from Asia skyrocketed over 200%; in addition, semiconductors, which were 60-70% reliant on one or two foundries became a household conversation as everyone was becoming dependent on smart homes and appliances. Supply fell far short of demand and prices skyrocketed as companies jockeyed for the same resources. It was the perfect storm as prices went higher, profit margins increased, wall street was reeling and hiring was the best it had been in decades as salaries increased. The perfect storm. Consumers that were denied in 2021 were now able to spend freely because they were making more money, the price of their home doubled. and they knew of nobody that was losing their job. Life was good.
Today, we are building 4 new semiconductor foundries in the US and the shortage of components is no longer an issue. Inflation has become difficult to manage, borrowing rates the highest in decades and young people that don't have a windfall of stock options at their disposal may not be able to buy a home in their lifetime.
I'm confident that this situation will resolve itself, but the party that the automotive manufacturers have enjoyed for the past couple of years will soon come to an end.
DOH! Totally missed that part. Nevermind... That does sound strange, but it sounds like the warranty terms of the battery, not the dealership. In other words, the battery warranty covers the cost of the battery, but not labor and the dealership may have cut him a break on labor feeling bad about charging him labor for not fixing anything if the battery was ok.
Naw 'cause he said he bought the battery from them. Assume they installed it too. Sounds like they weren't charging anything for installing the battery but were prorating the cost of a new battery if they needed one. I assume that's what they meant. Not scummy at all if that's the case.
Naw 'cause he said he bought the battery from them. Assume they installed it too. Sounds like they weren't charging anything for installing the battery but were prorating the cost of a new battery if they needed one. I assume that's what they meant. Not scummy at all if that's the case.
Agree. Doesn't seem like a scam. I've always used Infiniti for replacement batteries because the warranty last much longer than their batteries, so I always receive a new battery at a subsidized cost around the 3-4 year mark (I think I pay labor if its bad, but not if it checks out ok-didn't know they removed it to test?). Current battery is now over 4 years old, which worries me. The issue is that it must fail for them to replace under warranty, so it needs to be on its last leg to actually fail.
Agree. Doesn't seem like a scam. I've always used Infiniti for replacement batteries because the warranty last much longer than their batteries, so I always receive a new battery at a subsidized cost around the 3-4 year mark (I think I pay labor if its bad, but not if it checks out ok-didn't know they removed it to test?). Current battery is now over 4 years old, which worries me. The issue is that it must fail for them to replace under warranty, so it needs to be on its last leg to actually fail.
I think most shops would be able to test a battery without removing it, but clearly not all. Our Nissan shop has an enormous portable battery tester/charger that gets replaced about once every 10 years.
I think most shops would be able to test a battery without removing it, but clearly not all. Our Nissan shop has an enormous portable battery tester/charger that gets replaced about once every 10 years.
For my last replacement, they ran some form of testing for almost an hour before it finally failed. I knew it was close, because when the interior lights were on for a prolonged period of time (i.e. taking groceries in), or, if I parked and the headlights remained on during a call (like they do until you exit the car and close the door - I hate this feature), the battery would really struggle the next time I tried to start the car. Other than those types of signs, there's really no way of knowing. The battery in my wife's pilot died (i.e. can no longer hold a charge at all) on a roadtrip to the Bay Area over Christmas break during a torrential downpour. Gave zero signs of being even weak prior to failure.
For my last replacement, they ran some form of testing for almost an hour before it finally failed. I knew it was close, because when the interior lights were on for a prolonged period of time (i.e. taking groceries in), or, if I parked and the headlights remained on during a call (like they do until you exit the car and close the door - I hate this feature), the battery would really struggle the next time I tried to start the car. Other than those types of signs, there's really no way of knowing. The battery in my wife's pilot died (i.e. can no longer hold a charge at all) on a roadtrip to the Bay Area over Christmas break during a torrential downpour. Gave zero signs of being even weak prior to failure.
It is hard to tell in most cars, even if you have a battery gauge. It gets well below zero here in the winter so usually your car starts pretty hard a time or two and you know it's time for a new battery.
10-06-2023, 04:27 PM
