S vs. non S?
02-13-2012, 06:09 PM
#16
So Still havent pulled the trigger on my own 37. I definitely Want one but now the issue is that I'm caught between buying a S and a standard. For me the only differences that matter are the suspension, LSD, and the brakes So I've got some questions for you guys.
-How satisfied are S owners with your brakes kits? I know that's kinda a niche question to ask but trust me it matters. I spend as mucvh time on the circuit track as I can and good brakes are a must. 90% I'm going to drop in a new set of brakes anyway but there's always a discounted resale value of the 37s brake kit (for you guys!
)
-LSD: Whooo-eee Seems like there's a thousand different opinions on LSD's, about double that for aftermarket models and about a quarter of those are informed. So I'll keep my questions general
-How responsive is the LSD under acceleration through turns? specifically mid-third of the turn (if that makes no sense don't worry about it)
-In the rain/snow?
-how well does it handle off camber?
- For you guys with modded suspension, have you had any issues with the LSD insofar as responsiveness putting power down in both straight line and the corners?
-Suspension: Yeah It's getting swapped out, My question is about resale haha. I'm just wondering if anyone would be interested in an S suspension for Cheap? From what I understand the suspension itself is middle of the road for casual drivers. Pretty good, not the highest end.
-How satisfied are S owners with your brakes kits? I know that's kinda a niche question to ask but trust me it matters. I spend as mucvh time on the circuit track as I can and good brakes are a must. 90% I'm going to drop in a new set of brakes anyway but there's always a discounted resale value of the 37s brake kit (for you guys!
) -LSD: Whooo-eee Seems like there's a thousand different opinions on LSD's, about double that for aftermarket models and about a quarter of those are informed. So I'll keep my questions general
-How responsive is the LSD under acceleration through turns? specifically mid-third of the turn (if that makes no sense don't worry about it)
-In the rain/snow?
-how well does it handle off camber?
- For you guys with modded suspension, have you had any issues with the LSD insofar as responsiveness putting power down in both straight line and the corners?
-Suspension: Yeah It's getting swapped out, My question is about resale haha. I'm just wondering if anyone would be interested in an S suspension for Cheap? From what I understand the suspension itself is middle of the road for casual drivers. Pretty good, not the highest end.
Will this be your primary/daily? Is this going to be your only car? Have you driven on a 1.5 or 2 way LSD before?
- The stock calipers are fine. You will need better pads, however.
- The OEM LSD is reactive, not proactive. Also, it deteriorates, and once it is open, it is open. It uses a viscous fluid that expands to push plates together to function as a "LSD".
Based on what you've said so far, you're replacing all of the "performance" aspects of the S, so I'd say just get the base and save your money.
02-13-2012, 06:11 PM
#17
A lot of you didn't even read what the OP wrote.
If you are mostly running track the springs don't matter as you will probably going with coilovers, the seats don't matter as you will probably be going with racing seats with a 5 point harness, LSD doesn't matter as you will probably run something other than a stock LSD. The sport brakes don't matter as you would probably want to go with upgraded brakes. The sport brakes are heavy compared with most after market brake systems. I could go on but you quickly start seeing why a sport would be a waste of money in this situation. The Sport doesn't come with an aero package unless you add it on, but if you are tracking a car you don't want to put an aero package on that INCREASES drag. I could go on but a Sport does not make since in this situation. If he had said which is better a Sport or a non sport then it would have been a no brainer.
Come on guys read what was posted before you start responding.
If you are mostly running track the springs don't matter as you will probably going with coilovers, the seats don't matter as you will probably be going with racing seats with a 5 point harness, LSD doesn't matter as you will probably run something other than a stock LSD. The sport brakes don't matter as you would probably want to go with upgraded brakes. The sport brakes are heavy compared with most after market brake systems. I could go on but you quickly start seeing why a sport would be a waste of money in this situation. The Sport doesn't come with an aero package unless you add it on, but if you are tracking a car you don't want to put an aero package on that INCREASES drag. I could go on but a Sport does not make since in this situation. If he had said which is better a Sport or a non sport then it would have been a no brainer.
Come on guys read what was posted before you start responding.
but you said the sport is a waste of money, the sport package was 1850 brand new on my 08, i just looked at the sticker. i just checked z1 sells the akembo upgrade kit for 1395. the sport wheels and sport suspension. and paddle shifters. waste of money...?
02-13-2012, 06:16 PM
#18
I would get the S but upgrade the pads and rotors for sure, no complaints about the LSD here but serious trackers will argue differently (just wait till Mike chimes in lol)
On a serious note though, if you plan to track her a lot, I'd get a base model and get everything else track quality
On a serious note though, if you plan to track her a lot, I'd get a base model and get everything else track quality
If you are mostly running track the springs don't matter as you will probably going with coilovers, the seats don't matter as you will probably be going with racing seats with a 5 point harness, LSD doesn't matter as you will probably run something other than a stock LSD. The sport brakes don't matter as you would probably want to go with upgraded brakes. The sport brakes are heavy compared with most after market brake systems. I could go on but you quickly start seeing why a sport would be a waste of money in this situation. The Sport doesn't come with an aero package unless you add it on, but if you are tracking a car you don't want to put an aero package on that INCREASES drag. I could go on but a Sport does not make since in this situation. If he had said which is better a Sport or a non sport then it would have been a no brainer.
Come on guys read what was posted before you start responding.
Come on guys read what was posted before you start responding.
Weight from brakes is not a big deal. Caliper rigidity is far more important. Vendors on the board would have you think that unsprung weight in the form of wheels and brake rotors are a HUGE deal, but it's honestly not. The difference in drag racing 1/4 from stock 17 to wide and heavy aftermarket 20" is perhaps 2 carlengths.
Drag is not an important factor unless you're doing top speed runs. You want your average speed around the track to be as high as possible. A nicely balanced splitter and GT wing would likely increase the G's CdA by 200-300%, but would also decrease lap times significantly.
It all depends on what you're looking for. I drove my G bone stock, down to the tires. My track car has a mod list that's full page long, and only two of them are "power adders". Priorities
02-13-2012, 06:19 PM
#19
when i say i track my car keep in mind its still my daily driver. you typed too much and i dont even know where to start. you just mentioned upgrading over $10,000 of parts, why would you do that, it doesnt make sense to upgrade all that on this car.
but you said the sport is a waste of money, the sport package was 1850 brand new on my 08, i just looked at the sticker. i just checked z1 sells the akembo upgrade kit for 1395. the sport wheels and sport suspension. and paddle shifters. waste of money...?
but you said the sport is a waste of money, the sport package was 1850 brand new on my 08, i just looked at the sticker. i just checked z1 sells the akembo upgrade kit for 1395. the sport wheels and sport suspension. and paddle shifters. waste of money...?
02-13-2012, 07:16 PM
#21
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The brakes are the biggest thing for me. Most other things will be swapped out except say the LSD if I can avoid it. Thing is brakes are an expensive item. You can easily dropp 1300+ on a pair fo brakes that are up to snuff which I want to avoid if I can.
The "Test drive both" approach is hard for me because so much is going to be swapped out on the car that it's not going to ride at all like it does when I test drive it.
02-13-2012, 07:23 PM
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6 point. I don't like the risk of losing my junk with a 5 point.
Weight from brakes is not a big deal. Caliper rigidity is far more important. Vendors on the board would have you think that unsprung weight in the form of wheels and brake rotors are a HUGE deal, but it's honestly not. The difference in drag racing 1/4 from stock 17 to wide and heavy aftermarket 20" is perhaps 2 carlengths.
Drag is not an important factor unless you're doing top speed runs. You want your average speed around the track to be as high as possible. A nicely balanced splitter and GT wing would likely increase the G's CdA by 200-300%, but would also decrease lap times significantly.
It all depends on what you're looking for. I drove my G bone stock, down to the tires. My track car has a mod list that's full page long, and only two of them are "power adders". Priorities
As it is, with around 500 ponies under the hood, I'm worried about all them getting to the ground hence the LSD questions.
and on unsprung weight, I'de spend some cash on a CF drive shaft before I worried about my rims. I feel better about reducing rotational weight as close to the engine as possible before dropping dough on a pair of pressed graphite rims etc.
02-13-2012, 07:45 PM
#24
when i say i track my car keep in mind its still my daily driver. you typed too much and i dont even know where to start. you just mentioned upgrading over $10,000 of parts, why would you do that, it doesnt make sense to upgrade all that on this car.
but you said the sport is a waste of money, the sport package was 1850 brand new on my 08, i just looked at the sticker. i just checked z1 sells the akembo upgrade kit for 1395. the sport wheels and sport suspension. and paddle shifters. waste of money...?
but you said the sport is a waste of money, the sport package was 1850 brand new on my 08, i just looked at the sticker. i just checked z1 sells the akembo upgrade kit for 1395. the sport wheels and sport suspension. and paddle shifters. waste of money...?
If you change out those items then yes a sport is a waste. If you are a weekend warrior and not really going to be modding your car then a sport is fine. Read what I said, if you change out all those items which I see people on here do all the time it's a waste. Its like my IPL, if I was going to track or even mod it, I wouldn't have bought it. I would definately have gone with a base G.
02-13-2012, 08:02 PM
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Since most people don't seem to answer the questions.
1. Brakes - they work. If I looked that the data from a NISMO 370Z I'd say they don't work for track use at all. So if you're going to be "tracking" the car..skip the S and buy brakes, lines and stuff that is tested and works.
2. Suspension - Again if you're going to track the car another moot question.
If you are considering being a serious track car...first off the G isn't the best idea anyway, but I'd get a base and spend the money on stuff that is better.
As for Mike's comment about wheels...that rotating mass is one of the biggest changes to HP to the ground you can make. So lightweight wheels/tires is something that will make a huge difference. 2 car lengths on the strip is huge (and from my experience on my TT350Z from stock to pretty 20s...far greater than that, and the inertia of those spinning on a track will be too. Brake weight will be not noticeable. And unless they changed this from the 350Z the car has a lightweight CF driveshaft already?
Honestly nothing on this car really is "comp track' ready. It's a GT car for the street.
1. Brakes - they work. If I looked that the data from a NISMO 370Z I'd say they don't work for track use at all. So if you're going to be "tracking" the car..skip the S and buy brakes, lines and stuff that is tested and works.
2. Suspension - Again if you're going to track the car another moot question.
If you are considering being a serious track car...first off the G isn't the best idea anyway, but I'd get a base and spend the money on stuff that is better.
As for Mike's comment about wheels...that rotating mass is one of the biggest changes to HP to the ground you can make. So lightweight wheels/tires is something that will make a huge difference. 2 car lengths on the strip is huge (and from my experience on my TT350Z from stock to pretty 20s...far greater than that, and the inertia of those spinning on a track will be too. Brake weight will be not noticeable. And unless they changed this from the 350Z the car has a lightweight CF driveshaft already?
Honestly nothing on this car really is "comp track' ready. It's a GT car for the street.
02-13-2012, 09:32 PM
#28
Beer, can you point me toward posts where the stock lines and calipers are insufficient for track use? I have quite a few track buddies that are faster than the norm, and none of them have had problems.
2 lengths on a strip is indeed huge, but if you're not WOT, then the extra mass is more or less moot on a road course. I myself don't use the lightest wheels available to me. I prefer stronger, more rigid wheels, rather than the lightest. I've seen far too many bent/shattered rims to compromise there. With 500hp, the OP will rarely be WOT except on straights, unless he's a highly seasoned driver. If he were, I don't think he'd be asking these questions.
side note: if you equalize the tires between the stocks and 20's, do you think it would still "far greater than that", whether we used drag radials or re92a?
2 lengths on a strip is indeed huge, but if you're not WOT, then the extra mass is more or less moot on a road course. I myself don't use the lightest wheels available to me. I prefer stronger, more rigid wheels, rather than the lightest. I've seen far too many bent/shattered rims to compromise there. With 500hp, the OP will rarely be WOT except on straights, unless he's a highly seasoned driver. If he were, I don't think he'd be asking these questions.
side note: if you equalize the tires between the stocks and 20's, do you think it would still "far greater than that", whether we used drag radials or re92a?
02-13-2012, 09:49 PM
#29
Hate to break it to you man but those aren't really shifters. Like on most other sports cars those are just rev limiters. It doesn't so much shift for you as tell the car "Hey I want to shift now" and then let's the ECU debate wether to comply or not.
The brakes are the biggest thing for me. Most other things will be swapped out except say the LSD if I can avoid it. Thing is brakes are an expensive item. You can easily dropp 1300+ on a pair fo brakes that are up to snuff which I want to avoid if I can.
The "Test drive both" approach is hard for me because so much is going to be swapped out on the car that it's not going to ride at all like it does when I test drive it.
The brakes are the biggest thing for me. Most other things will be swapped out except say the LSD if I can avoid it. Thing is brakes are an expensive item. You can easily dropp 1300+ on a pair fo brakes that are up to snuff which I want to avoid if I can.
The "Test drive both" approach is hard for me because so much is going to be swapped out on the car that it's not going to ride at all like it does when I test drive it.
02-14-2012, 09:43 AM
#30
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I'm pretty sure he is talking about the Nismo 370Z's run at Virginia Motor Speedway. Went into the wall on Turn One (after a few laps) because the pads disintegrated. As a result, Nissan started offering a $500+ performance brake pad option for the Sport brakes.
However, Beer, I believe it was mentioned (perhaps by Mike) that the calipers are fine, but the pads would need to be replaced, which is what C&D said after the accident.
Edit C&D also recommends you upgrade the brake fluid and install brake-cooling ducts, as there isn't quite enough airflow to the brakes to cool them off (on the 370, not 100% sure on the g37).