VDC frustration
06-19-2008, 06:47 PM
#16
Truely skilled drivers are able to judge the limits of their car quickly, correct?
Now, these same skilled drivers are able judge the limits of the VDC/VSA/DSC/etc just as quickly.
Saying someone is a skilled driver, and saying that the VDC is disruptive to their ability to push a the car is a contradictory statement. Knowing the limits of the VDC, the driver should be able to still drive up to that limit.
Note: There are many MANY cars on the market, which will perform better in a controlled environment with their respective stability control system on, rather than off.
VDC is one of them. If you are setting it off, then you have surpassed the limit of the car. VDC is similar in the way it reacts to the VLSD on the car.
The VLSD will not kick in until there is actual traction loss; it is not preventative like a Torsen. VDC will not 'preventatively' kick in. There MUST be some sort of traction loss or readings that don't add up before it will intervene.
If it was preventative, it would be foolproof; they would not need to use the disclaimer saying that VDC cannot prevent accidents. I can make a car lose control with VDC on rather easily.
Now, these same skilled drivers are able judge the limits of the VDC/VSA/DSC/etc just as quickly.
Saying someone is a skilled driver, and saying that the VDC is disruptive to their ability to push a the car is a contradictory statement. Knowing the limits of the VDC, the driver should be able to still drive up to that limit.
Note: There are many MANY cars on the market, which will perform better in a controlled environment with their respective stability control system on, rather than off.
VDC is one of them. If you are setting it off, then you have surpassed the limit of the car. VDC is similar in the way it reacts to the VLSD on the car.
The VLSD will not kick in until there is actual traction loss; it is not preventative like a Torsen. VDC will not 'preventatively' kick in. There MUST be some sort of traction loss or readings that don't add up before it will intervene.
If it was preventative, it would be foolproof; they would not need to use the disclaimer saying that VDC cannot prevent accidents. I can make a car lose control with VDC on rather easily.
06-19-2008, 07:09 PM
#17
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I would agree with part of that statement. In that a skilled driver can certainly drive quickly and safely with VDC turned on.
However I have actually proven my car to be faster with VDC off than with it on. So there is obviously a certain amount of "intelligence" to the car predicting a loss of control.
However I have actually proven my car to be faster with VDC off than with it on. So there is obviously a certain amount of "intelligence" to the car predicting a loss of control.
06-19-2008, 07:33 PM
#18
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That's the thing, I'm not driving like crazy. But there are times where I want to take a right turn on a clear open road with a green light fast. It's almost like a dog that can't bark or bite. Compared to 330hp car where I can't even hear tires squeel on a sharp turn because the VDC kicks in.
Who knows, may be it was a good thing that the VDC was on, or I would have spun out, we'll never know. That's why I'm scured to try it with it off.
Who knows, may be it was a good thing that the VDC was on, or I would have spun out, we'll never know. That's why I'm scured to try it with it off.
06-19-2008, 08:10 PM
#19
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I just think too many of you guys grew up driving front wheel drive cars and do not understand the dynamics of a rear wheel drive car. I always turn my VDC off unless it is really raining or snowing. Take your time and learn your car and the dynamics of a rear wheel drive car and you will be fine.
06-19-2008, 08:31 PM
#20
The thing is, as has been said before, VDC is fairly crude. It cuts off your gas input on the car. I've had it do that when my back end was sliding out (which I was doing on purpose, just thought vdc was off, when it was actually on). It was mainly my fault for not realizing it was on, but regardless just cutting throttle is hardly a good system. I'm sure VDC has its merits from time to time, but the times I've seen it engaged it was purely cutting throttle and breaking the tires so they don't spin.
Also, if you're going in a straight line situation and gunning it, I get 2nd and 3rd gear scratches ( sure I don't do this often, but it happens from time to time ). When VDC is on, the instant you get that little scratch the throttle drops and the car lunges forward because of the break it applies to the rear end. I want my car to do that just about.....NEVER.. Which is why bar a snowing situation, VDC is off. Maybe some of you like it, thats fine. I however hate it.
Also, if you're going in a straight line situation and gunning it, I get 2nd and 3rd gear scratches ( sure I don't do this often, but it happens from time to time ). When VDC is on, the instant you get that little scratch the throttle drops and the car lunges forward because of the break it applies to the rear end. I want my car to do that just about.....NEVER.. Which is why bar a snowing situation, VDC is off. Maybe some of you like it, thats fine. I however hate it.
06-19-2008, 09:44 PM
#21
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I had a old Supra (85) back in 1990 and I only spun out once and that was in the morning mist.
As to the tire squeeling a bit on a hard turn doesn't translate to losing control. It just merely a warning signal to us that is the threshold and that no more gas should be increased but keep it steady at that level should be fine. Like most of you said it here, is that the G just cut throttle thus giving me a mix feeling that I don't know how to drive my car.
I used to take my Acura on a curve every day at this particular turn on the freeway and every day I increase my speed by a half to 1mph until I can feel the car is at it's max (80mph), so I knew what my car could handle. For those that live in San Diego. It's coming from SDSU, 8 west to the 15 north with merging traffic from the left and right and finally merging onto the 15 north. It's a rush.
But I'm all grown up now with a wife and two kids and scared of trying some thing stupid and paying for it.
As to the tire squeeling a bit on a hard turn doesn't translate to losing control. It just merely a warning signal to us that is the threshold and that no more gas should be increased but keep it steady at that level should be fine. Like most of you said it here, is that the G just cut throttle thus giving me a mix feeling that I don't know how to drive my car.
I used to take my Acura on a curve every day at this particular turn on the freeway and every day I increase my speed by a half to 1mph until I can feel the car is at it's max (80mph), so I knew what my car could handle. For those that live in San Diego. It's coming from SDSU, 8 west to the 15 north with merging traffic from the left and right and finally merging onto the 15 north. It's a rush.
But I'm all grown up now with a wife and two kids and scared of trying some thing stupid and paying for it.
06-19-2008, 10:35 PM
#22
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4 years ago when I bought my first G35 Coupe I was leaving a toll booth and wanted to get out ahead of the car next to me...Turns out that car was a Mini-Van who wanted to be me out there as well...My tires chirped in 2nd and VDC kicked on...Guess who went flying past me? Needless to say, that was the last time I had that thing on...
Snow and terrible rain storms are the only reason VDC will be on for me now...04 G35 coupe and now a G37 coupe...Without thinking I turn the VDC off everytime I start the car...I've learned the cars limits and know how to push a RWD car...Spirited and normal conditions, VDC OFF for me...
FYI - Front wheel and Rear wheel drive are obviously TOTALLY different...So you cant compare the tires screeching you get on a ramp from one car to the other...
Snow and terrible rain storms are the only reason VDC will be on for me now...04 G35 coupe and now a G37 coupe...Without thinking I turn the VDC off everytime I start the car...I've learned the cars limits and know how to push a RWD car...Spirited and normal conditions, VDC OFF for me...
FYI - Front wheel and Rear wheel drive are obviously TOTALLY different...So you cant compare the tires screeching you get on a ramp from one car to the other...
06-19-2008, 10:46 PM
#23
I drive spirited often. My VDC rarely if ever kicks in. My slip light will sometimes engage without the apparent or noticeable intervention of VDC. If VDC is kicking in often for you guys, you are driving quite aggresively or your roads are terrible LOL.
06-20-2008, 06:18 AM
#24
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The VDC is good but not perfect. It does kick in sometimes too soon and too much. I wouldn't call it intrusive like the Mercedes nanny, but it does err on the side of too safe in some situations. I can definitely run faster laps with it off.
06-20-2008, 09:56 AM
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06-20-2008, 10:53 AM
#27
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The only way we know if it's the car or driver is that if we can swap cars, but I don't think that will happen.
06-20-2008, 12:28 PM
#28
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j/k people....i will be waiting for the hate PMs now....
06-20-2008, 01:29 PM
#29
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^ PM sent 
j/k
My bet is it's not the VDC, you have a non-sport and that VLSD makes a world of difference if you're pressing your car hard on a turn. It doesn't surprise me in the least if you are taking a hard right trying to acclerate out with no limited slip that the VDC will kick in. Most of the people saying they don't experience this issue (myself included) have the sport model.
And I wouldn't say that you don't know how to drive the car in comparison to your old Acura, it's just the powertrain layout of a RWD is going to be much less forgiving then a FWD when pushed. This is one of the safety aspects of FWD, you always know if you're pushing your car too hard because even before tire squeal, the car will begin plowing through the turn and oversteer. You have to let off the gas or your car will go off the road or into a barrier, but you'll know way ahead of that that the car is pushing it's limits. RWD is different and especially so in the case of a high powered car, there will be little to no warning without electro nannies like VDC. Like that previous poster who had a friend with the 911, for most non-pro drivers, first time you'll know is when you're sliding sideways or facing the wrong direction of traffic.
j/kMy bet is it's not the VDC, you have a non-sport and that VLSD makes a world of difference if you're pressing your car hard on a turn. It doesn't surprise me in the least if you are taking a hard right trying to acclerate out with no limited slip that the VDC will kick in. Most of the people saying they don't experience this issue (myself included) have the sport model.
And I wouldn't say that you don't know how to drive the car in comparison to your old Acura, it's just the powertrain layout of a RWD is going to be much less forgiving then a FWD when pushed. This is one of the safety aspects of FWD, you always know if you're pushing your car too hard because even before tire squeal, the car will begin plowing through the turn and oversteer. You have to let off the gas or your car will go off the road or into a barrier, but you'll know way ahead of that that the car is pushing it's limits. RWD is different and especially so in the case of a high powered car, there will be little to no warning without electro nannies like VDC. Like that previous poster who had a friend with the 911, for most non-pro drivers, first time you'll know is when you're sliding sideways or facing the wrong direction of traffic.
Last edited by Orbie; 06-20-2008 at 01:31 PM.
06-20-2008, 01:38 PM
#30
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yea, you definately have to pay more attention and get used to the way RWD vehicles are. Ive driven plenty of FWD cars, but never owned one, all mine have been RWD, and I like it that way.
WHen out pushing my mustang around country roads, I definately have to pay all kinds of attention. My girls all like ... cool, lo0k at that house, its pretty, or ... check out the baby horse ... yea, no dice. I gotta focus on piloting that beast. But, that car has no electronic program to correct mistakes.
I like the opinions of goin to a huge parking lot and testing it out. If you dont know the limits of what the car can handle, how do you know what point to drive it up to?
WHen out pushing my mustang around country roads, I definately have to pay all kinds of attention. My girls all like ... cool, lo0k at that house, its pretty, or ... check out the baby horse ... yea, no dice. I gotta focus on piloting that beast. But, that car has no electronic program to correct mistakes.
I like the opinions of goin to a huge parking lot and testing it out. If you dont know the limits of what the car can handle, how do you know what point to drive it up to?