Review Springs, Sway Bars and Spacers... Oh My!
10-14-2010, 10:12 PM
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Springs, Sway Bars and Spacers... Oh My!
*****UPDATED 10/27/10*****
I've had my G for over 2 years now and have enjoyed 18,000 flawless miles out of her. But it seems that about once a year I have to get some upgrades for her.
I debated day after day between springs and coilovers; but with what I wanted (just to close the gap and give her a more aggressive stance) I could not justify spending $1000 for a basic set of coilovers. Knowing me, I would have to get a middle of the road set because I like to spoil her. Anyways, I ended up going with the Eibach Pro-Kit based on the reviews and the ability to run wider tires without having to trim and roll and run excessive negative camber. I also did not want my wheels tucked in the fender, its just a personal opinion.
Secondly, the sways, I ended up going with the Eibach due to the fact that they were hollow (a plus when we are talking purely about torsional loads) and the fact that the fronts were adjustable. Just in case I ever want to loosen up the front a little and get a slightly looser ride
.
Lastly, spacers, like everyone I don't like the tucked in look the wheels have once you lower the car. It just does not do the new aggressive stance justice. Ended up going with 20MM H&R DRM spacers as I would not have to press new studs in my hubs and it would give a nice flush look.
Installation -
I followed the following guide for installing the springs, Backyard Spring Install.
And the following for the sway bars, Sway Bar Install.
Spacers are pretty self explanatory.
Everything went smoothly, having only hand tools we used a 1/2" drive 2' breaker bar to get the bolt holding the shock to the lower arm off. Not an issue for either side. One thing we did need which was not included in the guide was a 21MM open wrench to hold the bolt on the end link side so it would not rotate as we tried loosening the bolt.
As many have noted, the spring compressors which are available at Autozone or Advanced do not fit the tightly would upper coils on the new springs. To get around this, we used Tie-Down straps to compress the new springs onto the shock. Two straps 180 degrees apart from each other was enough to compress the springs about 3"-4" to get the top hat back on. Last couple of ratchets had my friend supporting his weight on the top hat while I ratcheted each side down.
After this, everything bolted back on smoothly, using this handy tool Factory Service Manual we torqued everything down to spec.
All in all, Springs and Sway bars took 4.5 hours total (with a trip to the store for some tie down straps) for 2 guys with 4 jack stands to complete. The fronts probably took about 3 hours and the rears 1.5 hours.
I had to wait for the spacers for a few days as they were back ordered but just could not wait to install the other toys.
Some pictures of before:
Don't have many pictures of the sway bars installed as we just wanted to get the car back on the ground.
Front Drop:
Rear Drop:
Left Side before Spacers:
Left Side after Spacers:
Right Side is basically exactly the same so there is no real point in showing it.
Front wheels after spacers, mmmm... flushness...
Overall:
Gaps from the road to the fender (measured through the center of the wheel to the highest point on the fender):
Front Left: 26.75"
Front Right: 26.75"
Rear Left: 27.00"
Rear Right: 27.125" (I'm hoping this may settle or I will figure something out)
These dimensions are before any settling as I took them the day after the install. I will update this post after I get my alignment to see if it has dropped any more.
The ride - For all I can say, it is greatly improved over stock. Only slightly stiffer, but the turn in is vastly improved. Body roll is pretty much cancelled out and the sway bars have gotten rid of a lot of oversteer. I don't know how much of that is due to the increased negative camber of the drop, but it does allow for more fun in the corners.
Spacers have ZERO vibration issues, they are flawless. I was really worried about this as there are a lot of people who complain about this. But I just used very fine grit sandpaper to get some of the corrosion of the rotors and hub and I torqued every bolt in a star pattern to the correct torque (80 ft-lbs).
Look - I personally believe that the car looks way better than in the stock form. For keeping the stock rims, I believe this would be the best look for the car. Aggressive, yet still drivable.
I will be getting an alignment in about a week and hopefully they can bring it back within spec or on the verge of it. Will also re-adjust the headlights as I can now only see about 30 yards in front of me at night.
One thing I did notice about the tires thought, I have 5/32 tread left on the outside, yet 7/32 on the inside of the tire. This is both front and rear. Don't know if this is just my driving style, or the way they wear from the factory. But giving them a little more negative camber should even out the wear a little so I can get a smidge more miles out of them.
***************************UPDATE 10/27*************************
Just got my alignment done. My front toe as all sorts of messed up. Factory max is .08 degrees, Front left was .23 and right was .45. Damn! The car definitely feels ALOT better after the alignment in steering response, the weight and how it travels on the highway. I was getting some really bad tramlining before, and it is much better now.
To summarize...
Camber
Before / After
Front Left = -1.47 / -1.47
Front Right = -1.56 / -1.56
Rear Left = -2.2 / -1.78
Rear Right = -1.91 / -1.84
Toe
Before / After
Front Left = .23 / .02
Front Right = .45 / .05
Rear Left = .11 / .02
Rear Right = .18 / .07
I'm pretty happy with those numbers. On the rear the Toe is in spec and the Camber is right on the verge of spec (-1.83 degrees).
Fronts could use some adjustable upper control arms as the camber is about .35 degrees off between the two sides. Nothing I'm going to worry about now, but will keep an eye on the tires for wear. If the wear is noticeable I'll get something when the time comes for new tires.
The drop has now evened out on all four corners to 26.75". Yielding a total front drop of 1.4" and rear of 1". Pretty much exactly as advertised.
Thats all... I'm off to do some
I've had my G for over 2 years now and have enjoyed 18,000 flawless miles out of her. But it seems that about once a year I have to get some upgrades for her.
I debated day after day between springs and coilovers; but with what I wanted (just to close the gap and give her a more aggressive stance) I could not justify spending $1000 for a basic set of coilovers. Knowing me, I would have to get a middle of the road set because I like to spoil her. Anyways, I ended up going with the Eibach Pro-Kit based on the reviews and the ability to run wider tires without having to trim and roll and run excessive negative camber. I also did not want my wheels tucked in the fender, its just a personal opinion.
Secondly, the sways, I ended up going with the Eibach due to the fact that they were hollow (a plus when we are talking purely about torsional loads) and the fact that the fronts were adjustable. Just in case I ever want to loosen up the front a little and get a slightly looser ride
.Lastly, spacers, like everyone I don't like the tucked in look the wheels have once you lower the car. It just does not do the new aggressive stance justice. Ended up going with 20MM H&R DRM spacers as I would not have to press new studs in my hubs and it would give a nice flush look.
Installation -
I followed the following guide for installing the springs, Backyard Spring Install.
And the following for the sway bars, Sway Bar Install.
Spacers are pretty self explanatory.
Everything went smoothly, having only hand tools we used a 1/2" drive 2' breaker bar to get the bolt holding the shock to the lower arm off. Not an issue for either side. One thing we did need which was not included in the guide was a 21MM open wrench to hold the bolt on the end link side so it would not rotate as we tried loosening the bolt.
As many have noted, the spring compressors which are available at Autozone or Advanced do not fit the tightly would upper coils on the new springs. To get around this, we used Tie-Down straps to compress the new springs onto the shock. Two straps 180 degrees apart from each other was enough to compress the springs about 3"-4" to get the top hat back on. Last couple of ratchets had my friend supporting his weight on the top hat while I ratcheted each side down.
After this, everything bolted back on smoothly, using this handy tool Factory Service Manual we torqued everything down to spec.
All in all, Springs and Sway bars took 4.5 hours total (with a trip to the store for some tie down straps) for 2 guys with 4 jack stands to complete. The fronts probably took about 3 hours and the rears 1.5 hours.
I had to wait for the spacers for a few days as they were back ordered but just could not wait to install the other toys.
Some pictures of before:
Don't have many pictures of the sway bars installed as we just wanted to get the car back on the ground.
Front Drop:
Rear Drop:
Left Side before Spacers:
Left Side after Spacers:
Right Side is basically exactly the same so there is no real point in showing it.
Front wheels after spacers, mmmm... flushness...
Overall:
Gaps from the road to the fender (measured through the center of the wheel to the highest point on the fender):
Front Left: 26.75"
Front Right: 26.75"
Rear Left: 27.00"
Rear Right: 27.125" (I'm hoping this may settle or I will figure something out)
These dimensions are before any settling as I took them the day after the install. I will update this post after I get my alignment to see if it has dropped any more.
The ride - For all I can say, it is greatly improved over stock. Only slightly stiffer, but the turn in is vastly improved. Body roll is pretty much cancelled out and the sway bars have gotten rid of a lot of oversteer. I don't know how much of that is due to the increased negative camber of the drop, but it does allow for more fun in the corners.
Spacers have ZERO vibration issues, they are flawless. I was really worried about this as there are a lot of people who complain about this. But I just used very fine grit sandpaper to get some of the corrosion of the rotors and hub and I torqued every bolt in a star pattern to the correct torque (80 ft-lbs).
Look - I personally believe that the car looks way better than in the stock form. For keeping the stock rims, I believe this would be the best look for the car. Aggressive, yet still drivable.
I will be getting an alignment in about a week and hopefully they can bring it back within spec or on the verge of it. Will also re-adjust the headlights as I can now only see about 30 yards in front of me at night.
One thing I did notice about the tires thought, I have 5/32 tread left on the outside, yet 7/32 on the inside of the tire. This is both front and rear. Don't know if this is just my driving style, or the way they wear from the factory. But giving them a little more negative camber should even out the wear a little so I can get a smidge more miles out of them.
***************************UPDATE 10/27*************************
Just got my alignment done. My front toe as all sorts of messed up. Factory max is .08 degrees, Front left was .23 and right was .45. Damn! The car definitely feels ALOT better after the alignment in steering response, the weight and how it travels on the highway. I was getting some really bad tramlining before, and it is much better now.
To summarize...
Camber
Before / After
Front Left = -1.47 / -1.47
Front Right = -1.56 / -1.56
Rear Left = -2.2 / -1.78
Rear Right = -1.91 / -1.84
Toe
Before / After
Front Left = .23 / .02
Front Right = .45 / .05
Rear Left = .11 / .02
Rear Right = .18 / .07
I'm pretty happy with those numbers. On the rear the Toe is in spec and the Camber is right on the verge of spec (-1.83 degrees).
Fronts could use some adjustable upper control arms as the camber is about .35 degrees off between the two sides. Nothing I'm going to worry about now, but will keep an eye on the tires for wear. If the wear is noticeable I'll get something when the time comes for new tires.
The drop has now evened out on all four corners to 26.75". Yielding a total front drop of 1.4" and rear of 1". Pretty much exactly as advertised.
Thats all... I'm off to do some
Last edited by edge540; 10-27-2010 at 08:09 PM. Reason: Updated after alignment.
10-14-2010, 11:00 PM
#3
I have 5/32 tread left on the outside, yet 7/32 on the inside of the tire
Front Left: 26.75"
Front Right: 26.75"
Rear Left: 27.00"
Rear Right: 27.125" (I'm hoping this may settle or I will figure something out)
Front Right: 26.75"
Rear Left: 27.00"
Rear Right: 27.125" (I'm hoping this may settle or I will figure something out)
Also the moment the toe adjustment bolts are loosened, the rear will settle properly.
Did you retighten the upper control arms and rear spring perch with the jack fully supporting the weight??
10-15-2010, 08:12 AM
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With the rear spring perch, we torqued the bolts with the suspension UNloaded. The only bolt I have questions about is the tophat nut. Does anyone know if it needs to be torqued when the suspension is loaded? or should this have been torqued with the spring/shock assembly off the car?
10-15-2010, 11:00 AM
#5
Why would I need to do anything with the upper control arms? They were not touched during the install.
With the rear spring perch, we torqued the bolts with the suspension UNloaded.
With the rear spring perch, we torqued the bolts with the suspension UNloaded.
During my install I also loosened the front lower control arms, and loosened the rear upper control arms, then retorqued them fully loaded.
That removes the preload on the bushings after lowering it.
If you didnt do that the suspension takes just a litlle bit longer to settle.
The only bolt I have questions about is the tophat nut. Does anyone know if it needs to be torqued when the suspension is loaded? or should this have been torqued with the spring/shock assembly off the car?
BTW, It looks great!!!
10-15-2010, 11:21 AM
#6
Looks fantastic! If you are going to keep the stock wheels this is the way to go. Could you take a picture of the stance from the rear of the vehicle? I always wondered how spacing out the stock tire width would look from behind.
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10-15-2010, 11:58 AM
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perfect timing!
Looks so much better! Albeit I'm rolling in a sedan, this is exactly the plan that I am working on. Just got the Eibach's delivered this week and am about to order the Eibach sways & 20mm H&R DRM spacers. Hope to have everything on within a few weeks.
Thanks for the write-up! Can you now review the differences in ride quality, feel, & handling vs. the stock set-up?
Thanks for the write-up! Can you now review the differences in ride quality, feel, & handling vs. the stock set-up?
10-16-2010, 01:18 PM
#9
thanks for the review. this is going to be my next mod for sure.
any issues with the eibach rear sway bar clearing aftermarket exhausts or 4was?
any issues with the eibach rear sway bar clearing aftermarket exhausts or 4was?
10-16-2010, 07:30 PM
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Thanks for all the kind words all! I love the setup.
I don't have 4WAS so I don't know about that, but the fitment with my MXP exhaust is perfect. There are no places where it looks like it would remotely touch. Was one of the easiest bolt ons I have done.
I did at the bottom of my post;
I think I will try the softer setting in the rear in a little bit so I can try out some other settings to see where I like to drive at.
I will take a picture tomorrow afternoon and put it up. Maybe I will find another G around town (I have only seen about 2 or 3 here) and I'll park next to it to take the photo.
The ride - For all I can say, it is greatly improved over stock. Only slightly stiffer, but the turn in is vastly improved. Body roll is pretty much cancelled out and the sway bars have gotten rid of a lot of oversteer. I don't know how much of that is due to the increased negative camber of the drop, but it does allow for more fun in the corners.
I will take a picture tomorrow afternoon and put it up. Maybe I will find another G around town (I have only seen about 2 or 3 here) and I'll park next to it to take the photo.
