sniper27

iTrader: (2)

I read countless threads about swaybars and suspension and can't seem to come to a definitive answer. I have a couple questions. This applies to stock non-S suspension OEM 19s.

1. Does the G sedan naturally tend to understeer or oversteer? In my experience, I THINK it seems to understeer.

2. Which sway bar will help the most in steering response, cornering, and making the car feel more neutral. I like to reduce what appears to me as understeer. But if one bar produces more oversteer or understeer, please explain. I'm looking at either Hotchkis, Eibach, Stillen, or Whiteline swaybars.

Thanks.

Itchytoe

I have a G37S coupe, so not exactly the same car as you, but I think I can answer your questions anyway.

1. The G's platform (and the 350Z/370Z for that matter) does have a natural understeer, like the vast majority of front engine vehicles. Ours in particular are very easy to induce oversteer so even though I get far more oversteer in my car, the car itself has a tendency to understeer. If I push it to the limit, and I'm not inducing oversteer, my car will understeer first.

2. In order to make the car feel more neutral, you would have to either decrease its natural understeer or increase its natural oversteer. Either would help you feel more neutral. You could go with either a lighter front sway bar (which you probably don't want to do), or you could go with a heavier rear sway bar. A lighter front bar will make it understeer less, but you'll be stuck with a lighter front suspension because of it. I also don't know of anybody that makes lighter sway bars for any vehicle so you may have a hard time doing this. Your other option is to get a heavier rear sway bar. That will make the car more likely to oversteer and hopefully match the oversteer point with its natural understeer point. This is a very common upgrade, so I'm sure you'll find tons of aftermarket beefy rear sway bars. You list four in your question, and I don't have any personal experience with any of them so I can't tell you how any of them feel. As a general rule, you want the thickest bar to increase natural oversteer the most.

sniper27

iTrader: (2)

Thanks. so you're suggesting i only get rear sway bars and not the front also?

Itchytoe

If you upgraded the front and rear, you would have to go with a bigger upgrade for the rear. If you upgraded both by the same amount you'd have less body roll, and flatter turns, but you wouldn't alter the understeer/oversteer bias so it would still not feel neutral. It would definitely be an improvement, but I don't think it's what you're looking for.

In your situation, I would indeed suggest only upgrading the rear sway bar. If after you've upgraded that one, you find that you have too much understeer, you can always upgrade the front to put things back in line with what you want. I don't think you'll have that problem though.

I must warn you, modding is addictive. Rear sway bar is a cheap, easy upgrade that has a big impact on handling. Like Pringles, Once you start, you cant' stop

sniper27

iTrader: (2)

thanks for all your help. that answers one of my biggest questions. I've always wonder if I need to replace both front and rear swaybars. I recall in my VW and Audi, only the rear swaybar was recommended. it seems here, everyone replaces both. to me, that just seems like it would reduce bodyroll like you said, but not necessarily address the understeer issue. Thanks again.

AllentownG37

Hey guys,

I'm a bit of a n00b with suspension stuff and I had a few questions, if you don't mind. First, is there a difference in over/understeering with AWD vs RWD for our cars? Would that have any bearing at all on how the car steers? Also, for the aftermarket sways with adjustable settings like Hotchkis, does the tightness setting affect over/understeering? Thanks in advance for your insight.

Itchytoe

AWD vs RWD. I have owned FWD and RWD vehicles but never an AWD vehicle. The FWD vehicles have more of a tendency to understeer than RWD vehicles because they have more weight in the front of the vehicle, making the front harder to turn. I would suspect that AWD vehicles are similar because of the added front weight bias. With AWD you do have the benefit of those front wheels still pulling you through the turn. Hmm, I'm not sure if that makes enough difference to matter or not. Maybe someone with RWD and AWD experience can help out here.

AWD definitely alters how the car steers and handles. Exactly how it alters handling is again probably better for someone with AWD to explain as I don't have AWD.

Adjustable settings I can definitely answer for you. Tightness definitely affects oversteer/understeer. If you tighten up the rear, you're going to get more oversteer. If you loosen up the rear, you will get less oversteer. If you tighten up the front, you'll get more understeer. Loosen front, less understeer. Loosen them both, and you get less of both but at the cost of alot more body roll. Tighten them both and you get more of both, but you get way less body roll.

Don't forget, your tires play a huge roll in oversteer and understeer. Crappy tires will yield lots of oversteer and understeer. Good tires will reduce them alot. If you like the way your car feels, try better tires to reduce the aspects you don't like.

AllentownG37

Thanks Itchy, that's really helpful to know. And now a purely academic question; If one were to add swaybars that are adjustable (like the hotchkis sways), would it be worthwhile to set the rear to the tightest setting and leave the front on a looser setting to correct for the car's natural built-in understeer? I'd presume that the aftermarket sway vendors (in this case, hotchkis) would have taken the car's natural steering tendency into consideration and built their bars to compensate for it, thus leaving the adjustable settings for the driver to set how they like their car to feel through a turn. Would I be presuming too much?

Itchytoe

I would think that's presuming too much, but I could be wrong. Typically, they're just thicker bars than OEM bent into the same shape. It would take a lot of trial and error to figure out how to get the vehicle truly neutral and not everyone wants neutral handling.

I would try tight in the rear and loose in the front and see what happens. Then adjust accordingly. In the end, it's all about how the car feels to you. What I like may not be what you like.

sniper27

iTrader: (2)

judging by what you're saying, i'm almost leaning towards upgrading rear swaybars only. I know everyone gets both front and back. but from what you're saying, it sounds like getting thicker bars for the rears only and leaving the front stock will help the understeer, even set at the softest setting. correct me if i'm wrong. thx.

Itchytoe

It won't actually help with understeer. That won't change, but you'll get more oversteer so it will feel like the car is more neutral. With the thicker RSB you're just increasing oversteer, not reducing understeer. You would need some more serious suspension work to reduce the understeer tendency. Don't get me wrong, thicker RSB does more than just increase oversteer, but that seems to be what you're concerned with.

Remember, if you're confident with the way the car handles, even if the numbers say it doesn't do as well, you'll enjoy it more. If you're pushing your car hard enough to experience understeer or oversteer, you better be on the track and not endangering someone's kid. Drive safely on public roads.

sniper27

iTrader: (2)

no, i'm not tracking or anything like that. i just don't like that understeer when turning into a curvy onramp or overpass. i go up to the mountains sometimes and the understeer on the twisties is annoying. i understand a RSB alone will not eliminate understeer. But was hoping the increased oversteer will compensate for that. I was trying to get clarification whether RSB alone will help that or will both RSB and FSB be necessary.

Itchytoe

Yes, RSB alone will do that. I have to suggest slowing down if you're getting understeer on curvy onramps and overpasses. If that's the problem you're trying to fix, what you need are better tires, not a new sway bar. That or about 150 less HP.

Are you sure it's understeer that you're experiencing? You're obviously not dead yet, and have had your car for a while, so I'm not sure your issue is understeer (which is extremely dangerous). Can you describe when and what you are experiencing? What kind of tires are you using? Do you get the same results in the Audi or the M?

sniper27

iTrader: (2)

It's not THAT bad. It just feels like the car doesn't turn in as well or as quick. It feels like as I come into the turn, the car is fighting a little, and I have to quickly turn a little more to complete the curve. It's nothing that is not tolerable, but I guess I'm comparing to the Audi, where the steering is precise and tight. Turn in is effortless in the same curves. The M has some of the "understeer" feeling also, but doesn't seem as bad. I have Yokohama S. Drives on the G currently. 225/45/19, 245/40/19. I guess at the end of the day, I wish the G had better steering response and tighter around the curves. Since I have the opportunity to drive both the G and the Audi, it doesn't really compare to the Audi.

Black Betty

iTrader: (60)

Aftermarket sway bars will drastically improve your handling over stock. Period. Stiffer sway in front induces understeer. Stiffer sway in the rear induces oversteer. It's that simple. Buy both front and rear sway bars. Adjust the rear one stiffer or less stiff to your liking to amke it handle how you want. It's pretty simple.