Kidcane

iTrader: (7)

Lowering the height of the car and reducing roll doesnt improve the handling? Please explain.

Mike

iTrader: (1)

Unfortunately, it's not that simple



Lowering the car alters the entire car's suspension geometry. You may lower cG a tad, but now you've lowered your roll center slightly, and significantly increased your roll couple. Additionally, you've probably eliminated most or all of the negative camber gain from suspension compression, and lost some of your compression range.



You know how you get camber when you drop the car? That also happens under compression, but a lowered car can't get that extra camber, so you have to run more static camber, which most people will not. Increased roll couple will hurt weight transfer when changing lateral G directions.



Same goes for spring rate. Higher isn't better. High spring rate is like having static camber. Shocks will add to the net spring rate, similar to how body roll/suspension compression will add to the net camber of the car. You only want as much as you need, and no more.

RhiNoKiLL

iTrader: (2)

^ so are you saying that getting BC coils for an X will not improve handling?

platinumg35x

They're 8k.

soundmike

iTrader: (6)

The S2k, isn't it? You have to admit, you're comparing your go-kart to a whale of a G.

Thanks for the explanation, it seems you're mostly referring to the ideas behind it and not necessarily singling out BC in this case (or as your previous post led me to believe).

Your succeeding posts are as clear-cut as they get, but i do have to argue a little that the suspension tweak has helped this car, and this driver, in a positive way.

Plat, thanks for the confirmation!

OMG35S

iTrader: (2)

I always thought coilovers were better than most OEM suspensions. Don't all GT cars run on coilovers? Ofcourse they aren't comparable to BC but I thought due to the lower center of gravity and adjustability coilovers would overcome OEM suspension...

If there isn't any increase in the handling department than why do many enthusiasts go with coilovers? Springs will easily drop the gaps on most cars.

I'm basically looking for a good suspension that will improve handling on the street. If I find the time I may go to a track for fun. Our Gs look much better with a drop. Handling wise, am I better off installing springs than going with coilovers?

I'm really confused now. All this time I was thinking that decent coilovers would improve handling on our cars. What's your input on sway bars? I do believe that tires are crucial when it comes to handling.

Thanks for the input and more feedback is greatly appreciated!

soundmike

iTrader: (6)

If you really want to justify this modification somehow... spring+dampers or CO's. The way i look at it, the price and ease of installation of the BC's in particular is a stone throws away from how much springs+dampers will set you back, plus you get adjustability to boot.

Mike

iTrader: (1)

One of the most common things you see at the track with novices, is raising their ride height..

Simply put, the BC's may marginally improve performance, but most of it is psychological.

The best spring/shock combo money can buy results in less than a 2 second difference at a 2 minute track on my s2k. All coils with a retail of less than 2k have already been proven to reduce performance, or at best, be equivalent to stock. (not applicable to this car, but if you look at s2k coilovers, you'll notice that as you get more expensive coilovers, the range you can 'drop' the car tends to drop.)

GT cars run on a spring/shock combo which share little with off-the-shelf coilovers.

Sway bars alter lateral weight transfer from front to rear or rear to front, depending on what you stiffen up. If you stiffen up all around, then effectively did almost nothing. Stiffening the front would decrease front roll, and increase rear roll, and vice versa. This typically why you see a lot of cars lift a rear tire at autocross; they want maximum turning grip, so they run a SUPER stiff front bar and the stock rear (possibly even disconnected).

RhiNoKiLL

iTrader: (2)

^ interesting!

So lets talk about street driving/non track driving. Will i be able to take on ramps/turns faster and corner better than OEM? Cause right now I have a lot of body roll and all.

Black Betty

iTrader: (60)

So since this is a G37 forum and not an S2K forum Mike, do you have some specific insight on which coilovers for the G are proven to reduce performance and which ones improve it at the track? For spirited street driving?

Steveo47

iTrader: (8)

Mike, at times i think you know TOO much for us plebians

Gazan37

I agree with what mike is saying. Also keep in mind that on the street you have bumps and rough surfaces that a stiff car will very readily lose traction on, so in most scenarios a softer ride actually allows your tires better contact with the road.

Question to mike regarding sway bars. Won't the stiffer front end cause understeer? or is that just a myth?

Mike

iTrader: (1)

Generally, anything that is a "value" coilover won't improve performance, if at all.

If it were my money, I'd buy KW V3s, if I were looking for a value coilover. All the rest are junk IMO (BC, K-sport, etc.). I'll even go as far as saying that most of the JDM stuff isn't good, simply because the JDM coils are tuned for Japanese roads and tracks.

If you want some REALLY good suspension, find a local shop that services shocks for autocrossers. Tell them what you want, get custom valved Bilsteins or Konis, have the shop pair em with springs, and you'll have a serious upgrade for under $2000.

soundmike

iTrader: (6)

What exactly about these that makes them junk?

Mike

iTrader: (1)

hysteresis, lack of actual damping control, non-linear adjustments, lack of actual low speed adjustment

I can go on and on.

They are strictly for lowering.

You might pay double for the KW, but you're getting 10x the setup.