TS Lip.. Who to go with?
01-28-2010, 11:52 AM
#61
IB's main concern is money, not the members. It would be near impossible to get them to not allow vendors to sell TS replicas. If that did that, it would cut the vendors down to one.
I do agree it sucks, but it is never going to stop. Most people on here cannot afford a 10 grand for an unpainted kit (kit, hood, wing, diffuser). Then another 2k for paint and install of everything. I find it really hard to justify personally spending 30% of my cars value on a body kit.
People buy fake rolexs to impress others. Same as people who install replica TS parts. In the end only a real enthusist knows the difference. An average person just thinks, wow that looks good.
Plus Seibon/AIT/180 Customs/Carbon Creations puts their own names on the replicas. They are not trying to brand it as Top Secret (as fake Rolexs do). When you buy a Seibon TS hood for 300 dollars, you know you are not getting Top Secret quality.
I know it would never happen, but if Top Secret would sell their parts at a point where they are actually afordable, replicas wouldnt be necessary or even viable. Instead of 2k for a CF hood, sell it for 1k. Would get many more people buying.
I do agree it sucks, but it is never going to stop. Most people on here cannot afford a 10 grand for an unpainted kit (kit, hood, wing, diffuser). Then another 2k for paint and install of everything. I find it really hard to justify personally spending 30% of my cars value on a body kit.
People buy fake rolexs to impress others. Same as people who install replica TS parts. In the end only a real enthusist knows the difference. An average person just thinks, wow that looks good.
Plus Seibon/AIT/180 Customs/Carbon Creations puts their own names on the replicas. They are not trying to brand it as Top Secret (as fake Rolexs do). When you buy a Seibon TS hood for 300 dollars, you know you are not getting Top Secret quality.
I know it would never happen, but if Top Secret would sell their parts at a point where they are actually afordable, replicas wouldnt be necessary or even viable. Instead of 2k for a CF hood, sell it for 1k. Would get many more people buying.
01-28-2010, 12:10 PM
#65
IB's main concern is money, not the members. It would be near impossible to get them to not allow vendors to sell TS replicas. If that did that, it would cut the vendors down to one.
I do agree it sucks, but it is never going to stop. Most people on here cannot afford a 10 grand for an unpainted kit (kit, hood, wing, diffuser). Then another 2k for paint and install of everything. I find it really hard to justify personally spending 30% of my cars value on a body kit.
I know it would never happen, but if Top Secret would sell their parts at a point where they are actually afordable, replicas wouldnt be necessary or even viable. Instead of 2k for a CF hood, sell it for 1k. Would get many more people buying.
I do agree it sucks, but it is never going to stop. Most people on here cannot afford a 10 grand for an unpainted kit (kit, hood, wing, diffuser). Then another 2k for paint and install of everything. I find it really hard to justify personally spending 30% of my cars value on a body kit.
I know it would never happen, but if Top Secret would sell their parts at a point where they are actually afordable, replicas wouldnt be necessary or even viable. Instead of 2k for a CF hood, sell it for 1k. Would get many more people buying.
Cosmetic imporvements to our car have no other benefit than looks.. Spending $12k for a full bodykit is completely insane when you could just about have a TT for the same price.. For what your getting in an Authentic TS Kit it's not even close to worth it..
01-28-2010, 12:20 PM
#66
How is it a direct attempt to hurt your name and business? No one has said to not buy your parts.
You're basically asking us to not support your competition. Competition is a part of doing business. Survival of the fitest. If someone can make it better and/or cheaper, then they should.
You're basically asking us to not support your competition. Competition is a part of doing business. Survival of the fitest. If someone can make it better and/or cheaper, then they should.
Instead, they will just withdraw from the market (again), and other companies will just choose not to enter it at all.
In the end, all you do is hurt innovation by purchasing the knockoff.
It makes me sad, when people proudly display AIT and Seibon stickers on their cars. Very sad. It's painful.
Your definition of Competition is heavily skewed. There is plenty of competition. It is manifested in different kits for the car, not one kit that is copied by five different companies to see who can make it the cheapest. The parts are protected by trademark.
IB's main concern is money, not the members. It would be near impossible to get them to not allow vendors to sell TS replicas. If that did that, it would cut the vendors down to one.
I do agree it sucks, but it is never going to stop. Most people on here cannot afford a 10 grand for an unpainted kit (kit, hood, wing, diffuser). Then another 2k for paint and install of everything. I find it really hard to justify personally spending 30% of my cars value on a body kit.
People buy fake rolexs to impress others. Same as people who install replica TS parts. In the end only a real enthusist knows the difference. An average person just thinks, wow that looks good.
Plus Seibon/AIT/180 Customs/Carbon Creations puts their own names on the replicas. They are not trying to brand it as Top Secret (as fake Rolexs do). When you buy a Seibon TS hood for 300 dollars, you know you are not getting Top Secret quality.
I know it would never happen, but if Top Secret would sell their parts at a point where they are actually afordable, replicas wouldnt be necessary or even viable. Instead of 2k for a CF hood, sell it for 1k. Would get many more people buying.
I do agree it sucks, but it is never going to stop. Most people on here cannot afford a 10 grand for an unpainted kit (kit, hood, wing, diffuser). Then another 2k for paint and install of everything. I find it really hard to justify personally spending 30% of my cars value on a body kit.
People buy fake rolexs to impress others. Same as people who install replica TS parts. In the end only a real enthusist knows the difference. An average person just thinks, wow that looks good.
Plus Seibon/AIT/180 Customs/Carbon Creations puts their own names on the replicas. They are not trying to brand it as Top Secret (as fake Rolexs do). When you buy a Seibon TS hood for 300 dollars, you know you are not getting Top Secret quality.
I know it would never happen, but if Top Secret would sell their parts at a point where they are actually afordable, replicas wouldnt be necessary or even viable. Instead of 2k for a CF hood, sell it for 1k. Would get many more people buying.
Look at the GT-R owners who spend 20% of their car's MSRP on an exhaust.
To that end, TS does not determine the prices of their parts in the States. If you think you can market them cheaper here, I suggest you get in the business. There is plenty of money to be made. Keep in mind exchange rates fluctuate, as well as shipping costs. You also need to pay taxes, tariffs, and customs fees. Oh, maybe that's why authentic parts are so expensive.
Authentic JDM parts have a level of quality that simply cannot be matched by replicas.
Look at BBS vs Chicara wheels.
Or, how about Volks vs Rotas? Again, I ask, why didn't you guys buy a Hyundai Genesis instead? It features the same amenities, similar styling, and similar performance, for far less cost. Because you wanted the real deal.
Last edited by Mike; 01-28-2010 at 12:29 PM.
01-28-2010, 12:23 PM
#67
I don't think you get it. The reason Top Secret doesn't go after the companies that make knockoffs is because the legal fees would cost more than the profits they'd make from sales.
Instead, they will just withdraw from the market (again), and other companies will just choose not to enter it at all.
In the end, all you do is hurt innovation by purchasing the knockoff.
It makes me sad, when people proudly display AIT and Seibon stickers on their cars. Very sad. It's painful.
Your definition of Competition is heavily skewed. There is plenty of competition. It is manifested in different kits for the car, not one kit that is copied by five different companies to see who can make it the cheapest. The parts are protected by trademark.
Instead, they will just withdraw from the market (again), and other companies will just choose not to enter it at all.
In the end, all you do is hurt innovation by purchasing the knockoff.
It makes me sad, when people proudly display AIT and Seibon stickers on their cars. Very sad. It's painful.
Your definition of Competition is heavily skewed. There is plenty of competition. It is manifested in different kits for the car, not one kit that is copied by five different companies to see who can make it the cheapest. The parts are protected by trademark.
01-28-2010, 03:10 PM
#71
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Well said Mike. Thank you
This isnt a Poly vs Fiberglass argument. People can go with what they prefer. They both have pros and cons. Same with molding vs add on. This is about a company being allowed to market its knock offs in the same place as the original designer/manufacturer..
It's one thing for a costumer to post pix of his car saying he bought a knock off, and another for the vendor to advertise saying buy my product instead of the original cos its cheaper.
If this is allowed on here, whats the point in us being sponsors here?
Yes, I will contact the company that runs this website, but if nothing will be done, then we cannot keep being vendors on here. Our business is a lot about the exclusivity of our product. We will be debuting a new Top Secret kit and other products in April, we have been discussing about price and details. We even brought up promotional ideas like a special discount for forum members to get more people to try Top Secret products.
I work directly with Top Secret and am involved in production from start to finish. Although im pretty busy, I have tried to make myself available to the members on here to hear everyone's input and ideas. Same with Ken. Top Secret can develop any part better than almost every performance company here and in Japan. We can certainly consider making something if there is demand for it, but that would also mean being able to promote it in a place where other companies are advertising knock offs of those same parts.
This isnt a Poly vs Fiberglass argument. People can go with what they prefer. They both have pros and cons. Same with molding vs add on. This is about a company being allowed to market its knock offs in the same place as the original designer/manufacturer..
It's one thing for a costumer to post pix of his car saying he bought a knock off, and another for the vendor to advertise saying buy my product instead of the original cos its cheaper.
If this is allowed on here, whats the point in us being sponsors here?
Yes, I will contact the company that runs this website, but if nothing will be done, then we cannot keep being vendors on here. Our business is a lot about the exclusivity of our product. We will be debuting a new Top Secret kit and other products in April, we have been discussing about price and details. We even brought up promotional ideas like a special discount for forum members to get more people to try Top Secret products.
I work directly with Top Secret and am involved in production from start to finish. Although im pretty busy, I have tried to make myself available to the members on here to hear everyone's input and ideas. Same with Ken. Top Secret can develop any part better than almost every performance company here and in Japan. We can certainly consider making something if there is demand for it, but that would also mean being able to promote it in a place where other companies are advertising knock offs of those same parts.
01-28-2010, 06:47 PM
#72
Best of luck and please keep us updated on how IB responds.
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01-28-2010, 06:59 PM
#74
I say give it a shot. Because you think other places don't have knock-offs? Haha. Distributors and vendors are everywhere. If there's a cheaper option, people will know about it.
The fight's gotta start somewhere.
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01-28-2010, 09:00 PM
#75
BJ_ I apologize for contributing to the thread jacking.
Mike,
Exclusivity is exactly that. the price of that product dictates that only people of a certain stature or people who want to be seen as having a certain stature will go for the original parts.
As for your G37 vs Genesis question/analogy... the answer is clear as day. Everyone here bought the G because they like the car and could afford the extra $$$ to get it. People spend money on what they can afford.
Do you always buy the highest quality product for everything you purchase? Very unlikely. Like most everyone you probably either buy the highest quality product you can afford or do a cost vs benefit analysis and realize that for your needs, a cheaper options is better suited.
Anyone with even the slightest understanding of businesses and marketing knows that it s all about product positioning and brand image. TS is synonymous with High Quality which allows them to charge 2 to 3 times more for everything them make. The flip side is that it places them out of reach of many consumers. You can't seriously be upset because some1 is looking out for the "little people" and offering them an option
Don't get me wrong. I understand what you Ken and Emotiongear are saying and I'm all for getting more JDM product stateside and protecting them. However, you also must understand that the $$ being charged for the original TS products in itself created the market for the replicas.
Mike,
Exclusivity is exactly that. the price of that product dictates that only people of a certain stature or people who want to be seen as having a certain stature will go for the original parts.
As for your G37 vs Genesis question/analogy... the answer is clear as day. Everyone here bought the G because they like the car and could afford the extra $$$ to get it. People spend money on what they can afford.
Do you always buy the highest quality product for everything you purchase? Very unlikely. Like most everyone you probably either buy the highest quality product you can afford or do a cost vs benefit analysis and realize that for your needs, a cheaper options is better suited.
Anyone with even the slightest understanding of businesses and marketing knows that it s all about product positioning and brand image. TS is synonymous with High Quality which allows them to charge 2 to 3 times more for everything them make. The flip side is that it places them out of reach of many consumers. You can't seriously be upset because some1 is looking out for the "little people" and offering them an option
Don't get me wrong. I understand what you Ken and Emotiongear are saying and I'm all for getting more JDM product stateside and protecting them. However, you also must understand that the $$ being charged for the original TS products in itself created the market for the replicas.
Top Secret's goal is not to have as many of their kits out there as possible. Their goal is to provide a product of the highest quality, and a little bit of exclusivity. You may find it difficult to spend 30% of your car's MSRP on a body kit, but plenty of people do.
Authentic JDM parts have a level of quality that simply cannot be matched by replicas.
Look at BBS vs Chicara wheels. Or, how about Volks vs Rotas?
Again, I ask, why didn't you guys buy a Hyundai Genesis instead? It features the same amenities, similar styling, and similar performance, for far less cost. Because you wanted the real deal.
Authentic JDM parts have a level of quality that simply cannot be matched by replicas.
Look at BBS vs Chicara wheels.
Or, how about Volks vs Rotas? Again, I ask, why didn't you guys buy a Hyundai Genesis instead? It features the same amenities, similar styling, and similar performance, for far less cost. Because you wanted the real deal.
Last edited by soolman32; 01-28-2010 at 09:11 PM.