Ester Oil?

[Mike]

Yes, the oils we buy are based on technologies developed for race teams. The way I see it, the more competition there is, the better it is for the end level consumer.

Nascar and Indycar engines are all spec engines; logically, wouldn't they all have the same oil specification? I'd totally agree with you on your point of the NASCAR and Indycars all using indentical oil.

On the other hand, F1 and WRC cars are all propiatory, and have unique oils, even among different manufactuers that have the same oil sponsor.

All of the race engines' tolerances are MUCH tighter than consumer level engines, and the operating parameters are different (shearing resistance, temperature range, etc), and thus, my belief is that although the basic purpose and functions are the same the oil used is FAR different from consumer grade oil. Do I have firm evidence to back this up? No, only what is stated in press releases by oil companies.

[w0ady]

Originally Posted by notalk

Without seeing your blown engine and knowing what failed, it's pretty hard to determine the cause of the failure. I wonder if the failure was even lubrication caused.

the engine seized due to a lack of oil.

im friends with my service manager so ill talk to him and see how he feels about it. i know they didnt have a problem with mobil 1 on the g35.

[notalk]

Originally Posted by mike@riverside

Yes, the oils we buy are based on technologies developed for race teams. The way I see it, the more competition there is, the better it is for the end level consumer.

Nascar and Indycar engines are all spec engines; logically, wouldn't they all have the same oil specification? I'd totally agree with you on your point of the NASCAR and Indycars all using indentical oil.

On the other hand, F1 and WRC cars are all propiatory, and have unique oils, even among different manufactuers that have the same oil sponsor.

All of the race engines' tolerances are MUCH tighter than consumer level engines, and the operating parameters are different (shearing resistance, temperature range, etc), and thus, my belief is that although the basic purpose and functions are the same the oil used is FAR different from consumer grade oil. Do I have firm evidence to back this up? No, only what is stated in press releases by oil companies.

As I said, you can be right about this, and you can believe what you want. I only know what the people who build, and rebuild, these engines tell me. I only know what I actually see in the engine building facilities.

I am currently working with someone hired by NASCAR to review the internal specs of the COT engines as well working with a few F1 teams on some on the KERS approaches. (This same person will also report to NASCAR on the possibility of adding KERS to NASCAR cars in an attempt to reduce current output. Although, there are many questions about its applicability in semi-full throttle circle track usage.)

[notalk]

Originally Posted by w0ady

the engine seized due to a lack of oil.

im friends with my service manager so ill talk to him and see how he feels about it. i know they didnt have a problem with mobil 1 on the g35.

It sounds like the failure was not oil related, but lack of oil related. The big question would be "where did all the oil go", followed by "how did it get there?"

Once you know the answers to those questions, then the question would be "what part did the actual oil itself play in all of this?" It might be the oil had nothing to do with this and it would have happened with any oil you might have had in the crankcase.

[Mike]

Originally Posted by notalk

As I said, you can be right about this, and you can believe what you want. I only know what the people who build, and rebuild, these engines tell me. I only know what I actually see in the engine building facilities.

I am currently working with someone hired by NASCAR to review the internal specs of the COT engines as well working with a few F1 teams on some on the KERS approaches. (This same person will also report to NASCAR on the possibility of adding KERS to NASCAR cars in an attempt to reduce current output. Although, there are many questions about its applicability in semi-full throttle circle track usage.)

I am always looking to expand my knowledge and understanding.

Off topic, but how much are they looking to reduce the output by? I'm not a big NASCAR guy, but the playing field seems relatively even right now; are they looking for a gross output reduction by the engine only and keeping the net output roughly identical or are they trying to reduce speeds period?

[chasemyaccord]

Hey Mike, so what exactly do you guys use when we go in for a normal oil change at the dealership?

[Mike]

We buy oil bulk... its a blended synthetic Class III oil. It is NOT a full synthetic. Oil filter and washer are OEM.

I believe a UOA was posted at bobistheoilguy.com of our oil after 4000 miles and it indicated that the oil could easily have gone much longer.

I use 300V in my car. We stock mobil 1 (due to popularity) and Motul 8100 and 300V (out of 300V at the moment, but we should have more soon), and you only pay the difference in cost for oil if you want premium.

I havnt seen you in a few months...

[htownboy]

Eneos, Motul, Synthetic-Ester, Ester 'non-premium' synthetic, synthetic blend, Mobil-1, Blah Blah... Bottom line is the rating, A non synthetic oil can rarely achieve the highest API rating and when it does, it cannot maintain the rating more than about 3000 miles under normal conditions; much less for racing.

Look at the API rating for the oil you are buying, if it is "SM" you are buying something that is inferior; I use Royal Purple and they back up their product with a warranty that will pay for any damage caused by the oil. I was told by the parts dept at Clear Lake Infiniti that the Nissan Ester Oil has a "SM" rating which is much lower than an "SL"rating; This is a scientific fact.

So Ester, Easter, Thanksgiving or whatever they want to call it; you can have it and I will keep using an "SL" rated full syntetic oil; It's a far superior lubricant... I have personally used Royal Purple for years due to the additional warranty.

See email below

"Mark,
Thanks for the email and congrats on the new Infinity G37.
I show that the OEM is recommending the use of an SAE 5W30 viscosity oil meeting the recent API SM Service Classification.
Royal Purple recommends the use of the RP 5W30 Motor Oil.

The API SM Service Classification has reduced the amount of performance antiwear engine oil additives - capping them at 800 ppm with the theory that reducing the amount will prolong the life of the catalytic converter.
RP has chosen to continue to make the more robust API SL version as it contains 25% more of the antiwear additive to better protect the engine components. In three years using the SL in engines recommending the SM - we have not had a single claim for damage to a catalytic converter - with some now totally over 300,000 miles on the vehicles. We fell so strongly about this - we offer a corporate warranty. "

Royal Purple Inc
David Canitz
1 Royal Purple Lane
Porter, TX 77365

dcanitz@royalpurple.com

[Heat]

I like that he spelled Infiniti with a Y.

[htownboy]

Originally Posted by Heat

I like that he spelled Infiniti with a Y.

Yeah, I wrote back to him after that, pointing it out, but I didn't change the quoted email...

[Mike]

Originally Posted by htownboy

Eneos, Motul, Synthetic-Ester, Ester 'non-premium' synthetic, synthetic blend, Mobil-1, Blah Blah... Bottom line is the rating, A non synthetic oil can rarely achieve the highest API rating and when it does, it cannot maintain the rating more than about 3000 miles under normal conditions; much less for racing.

I used regular oil in my Corolla for about 160k miles... 7500 mile interval.

Never had a hickup, and UOA proven.

[htownboy]

Originally Posted by mike@riverside

I used regular oil in my Corolla for about 160k miles... 7500 mile interval.

Never had a hickup, and UOA proven.

I used Royal Purple in my Supra for 240,000 miles before I gave it to my brother who drove it another 75,000 before it was totaled in an accident. Never lost power or consumed oil; not sure if it ever had the hickups after i gave it away.

[notalk]

Originally Posted by htownboy

Look at the API rating for the oil you are buying, if it is "SM" you are buying something that is inferior; I use Royal Purple and they back up their product with a warranty that will pay for any damage caused by the oil. I was told by the parts dept at Clear Lake Infiniti that the Nissan Ester Oil has a "SM" rating which is much lower than an "SL"rating; This is a scientific fact.

American Petroleum Institiute Oil Service Ratings: "The latest service category rating for gasoline engines is "SM", introduced in November 2004 for 2005 and newer engines. SM-rated oils along with the previous "SL" (2001) and "SJ" (1997) ratings, are backwards compatible and can be safely used in older engines with exceptions (see update below). But the opposite is not true. Older obsolete service classifications (SH, SG, SF, etc.) may not meet OEM lubrication requirements for newer engines. Likewise, API SL oils should not be used in 2005 and later vehicles, and SJ oils should not be used in 2001 and newer vehicles."

[w0ady]

Originally Posted by notalk

It sounds like the failure was not oil related, but lack of oil related. The big question would be "where did all the oil go", followed by "how did it get there?"

Once you know the answers to those questions, then the question would be "what part did the actual oil itself play in all of this?" It might be the oil had nothing to do with this and it would have happened with any oil you might have had in the crankcase.

still waiting on infiniti corporate for their findings. who knows how long it will be.

[chasemyaccord]

Originally Posted by mike@riverside

I havnt seen you in a few months...

miss me? hahahahaa. yeah i haven't had a need to go in lately, and i'm not due for an oil change for another 1600 miles.

my brakes do squeak whenever i roll backwards and brake. maybe that'll give me an excuse to drop by lol.